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My bike isnt starting :S

Discussion in 'FZR250.com - Archives' started by Slingsh0t, Jan 10, 2006.

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  1. Slingsh0t

    Slingsh0t New Member

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    Hi Guys,

    I have had my '89 FZR250 for about 3-4 months now and over the christmas period I didnt do much riding. I normally ride it to work and back during the week and might take it out once or twice on the weekend for a joyride.

    Anyways, I didnt ride my bike for 2-3 days and when I tried to start it after then it didnt start! Now usually when starting the bike, it makes the normal repeating noise of turning over (of course) but now it is making a flat sound as if nothing is turning over. Initially we thought it may have been an issue with the spark plugs so those were replaced.

    Since then, it now either makes the flat sound, or sounds like it is going to start by making the usual turning over noises but still never starts!

    My uncle took a look at it (former car mecanic) and noticed that the pistons seem to have lost compression. He thought it might be a problem with the piston rings but the bike hasnt been blowing any smoke in the past. I have tried push starting it but that didnt work either <!-- s:( --><img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/icon_sad.gif" alt=":(" title="Sad" /><!-- s:( -->

    Does anyone have any ideas or has anyone seen this before?

    Any help I can get will be greatly appreciated!
     
    Slingsh0t, Jan 10, 2006
    #1
  2. koma

    koma New Member

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    No compression sounds like valves... but if it was working fine before then it seems odd that the valves have clogged up or the seats are no longer sealing simply due to inactivity - especially after just 2-3 days.

    Possible that fuel has seeped down into the cylinders over that length of time. It happened with my 3LN-3 whilst i (ok, me with a bit of help from TBone) was working on my clutch. Ended up cussing and swearing at it an awful lot but got it running again eventually after drying out the internals by pushing it along in 2nd gear with the throttle pinned open.

    I guess the easy way to check would be to see what sort of the condition the plugs are in after attempting to start it. If their wet then there's ya problem.

    Start from the start... three things required to run - spark, air, fuel.
    1. Check all the spark leads and plugs are operating and giving a nice solid spark.
    2. Check that the air filter is in a decent condition and not completely shagged and dirty. (If it's dirty it may make a bad situation worse)
    3. This is the big one... as there's so many variables, but the essentials are; fuel coming from tank? Carbs clean and functioning correctly? Idle screws set correctly? Choke closing and returning to off position properly?

    Once you've been through all of those we might have a bit more information to start specifically troubleshooting. Try working systematically through it all and sooner or later you'll (or we will!) find the problem.
     
    koma, Jan 10, 2006
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  3. Slingsh0t

    Slingsh0t New Member

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    Yeah they are wet, they smell of petrol. They are not dripping though.
    yep
    Air filter looks good
    I'll have to get back to you on these points.

    Thanks for the help so far! As you can probably tell, I have only recently started riding and this is my first bike so its all quite a steep learning curve.
     
    Slingsh0t, Jan 10, 2006
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  4. Starter

    Starter New Member

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    Check for fuel at the float bowls at each of the 4 carbs and drain then. Then run the fuel pump and test for fuel again.
     
    Starter, Jan 11, 2006
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  5. TiMBuS

    TiMBuS New Member

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    Well he claims the plugs are wet.. Might not be fuel issues.

    I've noticed I can get spark when the plugs are out of the engine but no spark while they're in. Dunno why.

    The battery is charged fully, right?
     
    TiMBuS, Jan 11, 2006
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  6. Slingsh0t

    Slingsh0t New Member

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    Just to give an update: I had another friend mechanic look at the bike and he is quite confident that the problem is a worn timing chain. A compression test was done which said it was very low.

    Do you guys know if it is a chain or belt for the timing?

    What do you think is the best way to fix this problem? Could it just be a tune up or will I have to replace it?

    Also (sorry bout all the q's), has anyone ever replaced the timing chain or is this best left for a bike mechanic (and how much would it cost to fix approx)?
     
    Slingsh0t, Jan 11, 2006
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  7. FZR Dude

    FZR Dude New Member

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    It has a chain.

    If it has low compression, it is going to be either Valves or Rings.
     
    FZR Dude, Jan 12, 2006
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  8. ACE

    ACE Active Member

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    Under comp its 7 times harder for the spark to jump.
    how meny km on the bike might just need a head job ha ha.
     
    ACE, Jan 12, 2006
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  9. TiMBuS

    TiMBuS New Member

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    Thanks for explaining that for me, Ace.

    Anyways, yeah. Looks like head repair might be in order.

    TBone says some people will do that. Good luck on that one though.
     
    TiMBuS, Jan 15, 2006
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  10. aussie3ln3

    aussie3ln3 New Member

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    ahhh <!-- s:alcoholic: --><img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/icon_all_coholic.gif" alt=":alcoholic:" title="Alcoholic" /><!-- s:alcoholic: --> this is the exact same problem i had on my 3ln_3 <!-- s:???: --><img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/icon_confused.gif" alt=":???:" title="Confused" /><!-- s:???: --> i spent 3 days trying to get it to start before biting the bullet and sending it to a shop <!-- s:mad: --><img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/icon_mad.gif" alt=":mad:" title="Mad" /><!-- s:mad: --> .....it was CARBON BUILD UP on the intake valves causing them to stick open and LOSE COMPRESSION <!-- s:cry: --><img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/icon_cry.gif" alt=":cry:" title="Crying or Very sad" /><!-- s:cry: --> .......my valves were de-carbon'd and spark plugs replaced <!-- s:) --><img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/icon_smile.gif" alt=":)" title="Smile" /><!-- s:) --> ....she now runs like a true fizzer....screaming <!-- s:cool: --><img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/icon_cool.gif" alt=":cool:" title="Cool" /><!-- s:cool: -->
     
    aussie3ln3, Jan 16, 2006
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  11. Slingsh0t

    Slingsh0t New Member

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    Do you mind if I ask how much it was to get fixed at the shop aussie3ln3?
     
    Slingsh0t, Jan 16, 2006
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  12. TBone

    TBone New Member

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    LOL carbon built up!! clasic...

    yep these engines suffer from this SO much... the bigest cause for this is running it at low RPM... some thing most noobs unfortunately do a bit to often...

    Best way is to clean them on regular basis witha special decarbon addetive to fuel... but there are other methods <!-- s:D --><img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/icon_biggrin.gif" alt=":D" title="Very Happy" /><!-- s:D -->
     
    TBone, Jan 16, 2006
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  13. koma

    koma New Member

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    Yeah loan it to me or TBone for a weekend through the hills... we'll get it cleared right up. <!-- s:D --><img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/icon_biggrin.gif" alt=":D" title="Very Happy" /><!-- s:D --> <!-- s:lol: --><img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/icon_lol.gif" alt=":lol:" title="Laughing" /><!-- s:lol: --> <!-- s:D --><img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/icon_biggrin.gif" alt=":D" title="Very Happy" /><!-- s:D -->
    I always said my 3LN needed a good blast once a week to keep it in good shape - guess it was closer to the truth than i expected. <!-- s:roll: --><img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/icon_roll.gif" alt=":roll:" title="Rolling LoL" /><!-- s:roll: -->
     
    koma, Jan 16, 2006
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  14. Patske

    Patske New Member

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    You got it fixed yet? When I don't ride my bike for a couple of days it's just flooded. And I sit there on it for about a good 5 minutes on the ignition switch letting it turn over giving it a bit of throttle every now and then. Eventually the bastard starts.
     
    Patske, Jan 16, 2006
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  15. Patske

    Patske New Member

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    if I ride it every day it starts fine first shot.
     
    Patske, Jan 16, 2006
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  16. aussie3ln3

    aussie3ln3 New Member

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    it cost me 380 with labour being the majority of it <!-- s:alcoholic: --><img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/icon_all_coholic.gif" alt=":alcoholic:" title="Alcoholic" /><!-- s:alcoholic: -->
     
    aussie3ln3, Jan 20, 2006
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  17. Casso

    Casso New Member

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    If it's flooded i just push start it with the fuel tap turned to off. Takes the usual fine hand work with the accelerator to keep it running (roll it off slowly until it's just about to die, then hold it there)... works a treat.
     
    Casso, Jan 20, 2006
    #17
  18. Slingsh0t

    Slingsh0t New Member

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    Well, its just gone into the shop this morning. After many calls to many places in melbourne and getting common responses of "hrrmmm...not sure how much we can do with that considering its an import an all..." the place I took it to was a yamaha place so hopefully they will be able to fix my baby <!-- s:( --><img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/icon_sad.gif" alt=":(" title="Sad" /><!-- s:( -->

    The guy said with this model bike that "they tend to be fiddly which can rack up the price quickly"...I interpreted this as "well, you dont look like you know much so we'll be charging alot". <!-- s:lol: --><img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/icon_lol.gif" alt=":lol:" title="Laughing" /><!-- s:lol: -->

    Anyways, I'm just hoping that the price stays within my budget <!-- s:???: --><img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/icon_confused.gif" alt=":???:" title="Confused" /><!-- s:???: -->
     
    Slingsh0t, Jan 20, 2006
    #18
  19. Slingsh0t

    Slingsh0t New Member

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    <!-- s:( --><img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/icon_sad.gif" alt=":(" title="Sad" /><!-- s:( --> <!-- s:( --><img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/icon_sad.gif" alt=":(" title="Sad" /><!-- s:( --> <!-- s:( --><img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/icon_sad.gif" alt=":(" title="Sad" /><!-- s:( --> <!-- s:( --><img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/icon_sad.gif" alt=":(" title="Sad" /><!-- s:( --> <!-- s:( --><img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/icon_sad.gif" alt=":(" title="Sad" /><!-- s:( -->

    Well...After a couple of days at the mechanic he calls me and tells me that the bike has very little compression (which I already knew). His guess was that it was either the Valves or the Rings (which I had already guessed also) and that so far, it's costing me $386 + parts(approx $50).

    THEN, I speak with him again two days later and he tells me that they have run a compression test which shows the engine has lost alot of compression (once again...nothing new) and this time he gave me the pressure levels in each cylinder.

    He said that it looks like the bike is buggered and that it will need a change of the rings and valves..I ask him how much that would all cost me? And he quotes: $2,000!!! *I almost fell off my seat* <!-- s:sniper: --><img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/icon_snipersmilie.gif" alt=":sniper:" title="Sniper" /><!-- s:sniper: -->

    I told him I'm not paying that much, and that I would get back to him later with my decision if I want to go through with the repairs or not.

    What should I do guys?? In my opinion, it seems like this mechanic has done nothing except for a compression test and then turns around and tells me $2k... <!-- s:( --><img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/icon_sad.gif" alt=":(" title="Sad" /><!-- s:( -->

    This has basically also sparked my desire to learn how to fix it myself, so thats what I would like to try but I wouldnt have much idea of what I would be doing.

    Any ideas or words of advice?
     
    Slingsh0t, Jan 24, 2006
    #19
  20. ACE

    ACE Active Member

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    What part of oz do you liv in maby some one will have a mc you can go and see. If the bike has over 25000ks on it i would say its the head and over 45000k for the rings but still couled only be the heads.
    I got my heads re shimed and a new cam cover gaskit for $250 and you can pic up 2nd hand motors for under a $1000 with low ks.
     
    ACE, Jan 24, 2006
    #20
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