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1980 GSX250 - no spark

Discussion in 'Suzuki 250cc Twins' started by Frankster, Sep 28, 2015.

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  1. Murdo

    Murdo The Good Doctor Staff Member Contributing Member Ride and Events Crew

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    Do you have spark if you just 'hot wire' to the coils?
     
    Murdo, Oct 12, 2015
    #21
  2. Frankster

    Frankster Grey Pride...Adventure before Dementia Staff Member Premium Member Ride and Events Crew

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    Yes, frustrating, but I'm keen to get the bike running again. Have managed to track down part number for original RegRec for my bike. Used partzilla and a number of other sites before determining that the GS250 appears to have the same electrics as my bike. People asking silly money for Suzuki part, but have found one that seems to be what the manual refers to. Will wait for the eBay ordered RegRec to show up before ordering the other one (see below). There is one too many wires in the Yamaha RegRec that's on the bike, so need to figure out how the bike was running and configured and then how the standard unit fits into the picture I might have to find a sparky and see if they can make that part of the loom for me. Will wait and see what happens with eBay RegRec. This is the RegRec I think should be on the bike...

    Suzuki GS250 RR.jpg
     
    • Like Like x 1
    Frankster, Oct 12, 2015
    #22
  3. Frankster

    Frankster Grey Pride...Adventure before Dementia Staff Member Premium Member Ride and Events Crew

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    How do I do that Murdo?
     
    Frankster, Oct 12, 2015
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  4. Murdo

    Murdo The Good Doctor Staff Member Contributing Member Ride and Events Crew

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    Small wire from + of battery to the power terminal of coils (after you have disconnected from the loom). Just do it to try (as the coils may not like full 12volts and will get hot) and see if you get spark while cranking.
     
    Murdo, Oct 13, 2015
    #24
  5. Frankster

    Frankster Grey Pride...Adventure before Dementia Staff Member Premium Member Ride and Events Crew

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    Thanks Murdo. I will have a crack once I have the electrics back together.
     
    Frankster, Oct 13, 2015
    #25
  6. Ben Mulligan

    Ben Mulligan Well-Known Member Premium Member Contributing Member

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    How did you go?
     
    Ben Mulligan, Oct 13, 2015
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  7. Frankster

    Frankster Grey Pride...Adventure before Dementia Staff Member Premium Member Ride and Events Crew

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    Pretty ordinary Ben. The R/R on my bike is a Yamaha unit. I went and had a look at another 1980 GSX250 and it also had a Yamaha unit. The other bike also had the same problem as mine...no spark! I've ordered what I think is the right unit from eBay, so I'll know better once it arrives and I bolt it on. I might still pop over and say gidday on the weekend or after work one night to have a look at your beast. I can see the attraction to Bobber these bikes and if I didn't have so many projects on the go I'd have a go myself.

    Talk soon

    Frank
     
    Frankster, Oct 13, 2015
    #27
  8. Frankster

    Frankster Grey Pride...Adventure before Dementia Staff Member Premium Member Ride and Events Crew

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    I'm wondering if I have the right wiring diagram. I got it from the RESOURCES section of this site, but I'm confused. The sample image I've attached seems to show three wires coming from the ignitor into the loom and making different connections. The three (yellow) wires coming from my bike's ignitor are all going to the R/R. Can someone please confirm which wiring diagram I should be using as gospel?

    Wiring Diagram.jpg
     
    Frankster, Oct 15, 2015
    #28
  9. Evo

    Evo Well-Known Member

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    That's the diagram that I have. What I have discovered is that my '84 bike is 6 wire but the '81 (I think) parts bike is 5 wire. See link below for a good explanation of how these thing things work.
    I could be wrong and feel free to correct me but on this bike the reg/rec would not hamper the spark. I also feel that these units should be interchangeable as it is in its basic 5wire form, it is just 3wire AC in through diodes to DC out.

    This is one of the last items for me to sort out in my bike. My GSX is currently running without a r/r. I need to order a new one. Must do this soon.

    http://www.electrosport.com/technic...articles/how-motorcycle-charging-system-works
     
    Evo, Oct 16, 2015
    #29
  10. Frankster

    Frankster Grey Pride...Adventure before Dementia Staff Member Premium Member Ride and Events Crew

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    So, I'm guessing you think the problem might be in the CDI unit or the coils. FYI, the engine was turning over when I wasn't getting spark, so whatever powers the starter was working. I will put the bike back together with the dud R/R and test the coils and CDI. Does it matter what order the 3 wires from the ignitor go into the R/R?
     
    Frankster, Oct 17, 2015
    #30
  11. Joker

    Joker See "about me" for contact details. Contributing Member

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    I've been reading up a bit more mate and to be honest I'm kinda leaning the other way now. Because the reg/rec regulates the current to the battery I thought it may affect spark but I'm starting to think it may really only affect how well the battery charges... the fact you don't have an OEM reg/rec may not make much difference if it's regulating to the correct voltage to charge the bike.

    Most likely scenario I"m thinking now is you've just shorted a cell in the battery itself - I'd be trying another battery and testing yours as much as possible. Have you done that? Even though it's a new battery you can still short it out.

    If it gives you anything under 12VDC at rest I'd be worried about it.
     
    Joker, Oct 17, 2015
    #31
  12. Ben Mulligan

    Ben Mulligan Well-Known Member Premium Member Contributing Member

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    I just found my charge circuit isn't working too, however the battery ALSO had a dud cell. When I replaced the new battery the readouts are as follows.

    Resting = 13v
    Accessories on 12.8v
    Bike Running =12v (should be 14.2v roughly)

    Knowing my stator looked brand new when I pulled he engine apart I'm going to run through the book with my multimeter and test the output of everything and make sure all my cables are insulated properly. It might be the after market rec/reg or I've missed a wire or something
     
    Ben Mulligan, Oct 17, 2015
    #32
  13. Murdo

    Murdo The Good Doctor Staff Member Contributing Member Ride and Events Crew

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    Also make sure you have a good earth from engine to battery/frame.
     
    Murdo, Oct 17, 2015
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  14. Ben Mulligan

    Ben Mulligan Well-Known Member Premium Member Contributing Member

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    Wouldnt the engine earth through its mounts? Its original earth cable that leaves at the rear of the block was rusted over and couldnt remove its screw
     
    Ben Mulligan, Oct 17, 2015
    #34
  15. Linkin

    Linkin The Mechanic Premium Member Contributing Member Dirty Wheel Club

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    Then what completes the circuit? If you have no earth you will no electrics. There is usually always an earth/negative going from the battery to the engine cases.
     
    Linkin, Oct 17, 2015
    #35
  16. Evo

    Evo Well-Known Member

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    That's what I would be looking at. Along with ensuring that all your connections are correct.

    Make sure that you know how to use your multimeter and familiarise yourself with the wiring diagram. If you work through it wire by wire you should sort it out.
     
    Evo, Oct 17, 2015
    #36
  17. Evo

    Evo Well-Known Member

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    If you test between any 2 out of the 3 wires out of the stator you should be getting around 30V remembering that this is alternating current AC. the output should be 12V DC
     
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    Evo, Oct 17, 2015
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  18. Murdo

    Murdo The Good Doctor Staff Member Contributing Member Ride and Events Crew

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    The frame mounts MAY be earthing ok, but are they? If you were to rely solely on the mounts you would have to clean them to bright metal (engine and frame) and use a dilectric grease between them to prevent any corrosion. Have you done this?
    Engines will sometimes have a dedicated wire from the block to the battery to take the starter motor current load. You say that your is rusted over, so how can you be sure it is earthing correctly?
    I suggest that you either clean that earth or make a new wire to another bolt on the crankcase somewhere to eliminate any future problems.
    Hope this helps.
     
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    Murdo, Oct 18, 2015
    #38
  19. Frankster

    Frankster Grey Pride...Adventure before Dementia Staff Member Premium Member Ride and Events Crew

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    I will try this test and see if the battery is knackered. Makes some sense as I couldn't smell or see and burn on any of the parts on the plate (R/R, CDI, Starter etc). I assume the starter doesn't need the full 12V to kick over. Interesting.
     
    Frankster, Oct 18, 2015
    #39
  20. Frankster

    Frankster Grey Pride...Adventure before Dementia Staff Member Premium Member Ride and Events Crew

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    12.84
     
    Frankster, Oct 18, 2015
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